Subjects: Bondi Junction tragedy; National Security Committee of Cabinet; Labor’s immigration detention shambles and border security failures; Labor’s Big Australia policy; Richard Marles’ Defence cuts.

 

E&OE

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Every Thursday we’re joined by the Opposition Leader, Peter Dutton. He’s online right now in Sydney.

 

Peter Dutton, good morning to you.

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

Good morning, Ray.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Now, I understand, like many, you’ve gone and paid your respects at Bondi this morning. What did you encounter?

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

We were up there this morning and obviously a lot of still raw emotion and people who had been impacted on the day, and many were there laying wreaths and teddy bears amongst the flowers and really heartfelt messages.

 

So, there’s a lot of obvious anger still and bewilderment. People just can’t explain how another human could react like that. Also the acts of bravery – that incredible policewoman who saved lives, undoubtedly. People were talking about that as well.

 

So, it was a nice thing to do but you can still feel the emotion there. So, hopefully those people in hospital make a speedy recovery. There’d be many people who are scarred for life out of it.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

You’ve taken a bipartisan attitude in relation to the French national, Damien Guerot, the ‘Bollard Man’, and now Muhammad Taha, the security guard originally from Pakistan who was badly injured – and another one of his colleagues was one of those unfortunately killed –in offering them, of course if they wish to, permanent residency and citizenship here.

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

I think in a circumstance that when you look at the footage of that young bloke holding the bollard at the top of the escalator – he didn’t need to do that, he didn’t need to be there, it’s not his country. I just think the acts of strangers helping other people that they’ve never met before and putting their own lives at risk, or those who were on the ground applying pressure to puncture wounds in young children or women – they’re pretty heroic acts. I mean, we want people of good character coming to our country. We live in the best country in the world and should make sure that those people who are coming here are of the best character, and we shouldn’t have any hesitation around that. It struck me that this young bloke’s ticking a lot of those boxes. I didn’t see him on the Today Show this morning, but they tell me he was a pretty impressive young fellow and very humble. They’re the sorts of Australians that we want.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Look, I have a regular chat, as you probably know, with the AFP Commissioner Reece Kershaw, and that happened this week. This is unrelated to Bondi, but related to what happened to Wakeley. It was revealed by him, and he didn’t seem to have a problem with it, that he doesn’t have a permanent seat on the National Cabinet Security Committee. So, he joins the likes of ASIO and ASIS as people who have to be invited along there, which seems unbelievable when we’re in a time of crisis and there’s an alleged terrorist attack happening, that these three people have to be invited by the Prime Minister to join Casanova Bowen. I don’t know what he does there? Whether he says, ‘oh look, it’s getting a bit hot out there so this could influence the people who are inclined towards terror’. I don’t know what he’s doing there in the first place, but surely the others have to be there permanently?

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

I don’t understand the Prime Minister’s decision here, Ray. I mean, I was on the National Security Committee for six years. A lot of topics that you discuss, and a lot of issues, you know, maybe in the Defence portfolio that the Australian Federal Police Commissioner contributes to because he’s got people posted to a particular part of the world and has some intelligence or had a conversation with one of his officers and vice versa. So, it goes on.

 

To have them sitting outside in the waiting room, and to only come in the room when they’re invited, firstly, I think it’s insulting, but more importantly, I think it doesn’t result in the best decision-making that you can make. Why on earth you’d have the Climate Change Secretary there in the room and not the head of ASIO or the head of the Australian Federal Police or the head of ASIS, is completely and utterly beyond me.

 

So, I mean, when we see these boats arriving and you see the Government who doesn’t know which way to turn in relation to the level of anti-Semitism in our country at the moment and a number of other issues, I think it’s quite a dangerous act, and I think it’s a risky act by the Prime Minister and it’s illogical.

 

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Yeah. The High Court yesterday – and they’re now pondering what they’ll do – another or in fact, two challenges. There was one belatedly given to another bloke, but the first one was ASF17. I thought it was a bit bizarre, his counsel, Lisa De Ferrari, says her client would prefer to be sent to Gaza because of his bisexuality. He claims that his wife saw him having sex with a man. He’s also obviously having sex with his wife, given he’s bisexual. But obviously he doesn’t know too much about Gaza because they recently put one of their very own to death for being homosexual as opposed to bisexual. And if you’re caught in an act with another man, it’s a ten year prison sentence. So, I don’t know how he fits Gaza into the equation?

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

Well, and of course, all of these people who are waving flags at the moment, abusing people of Jewish faith and on university campuses who are protesting when somebody from Israel comes to give a lecture. All those people conveniently forget the realities of what Hamas is as an organisation. It’s no different to Al-Qaeda. Hamas is a listed terrorist organisation, and they do treat people in that way. They do behead people and they do conduct themselves in a way that’s barbaric, as we saw on October 7. So, I won’t make any comment in relation to the matter that’s before the High Court at the moment…

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Sure.

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

…But I know as Immigration Minister, there were lots of people who found Christianity and started to question their sexuality late in life because it got them on a pathway to migration, and all of a sudden, if they were a Christian and couldn’t be returned back to Iran, that was their latest claim to protection. You’d want to test those claims very carefully, because I think sometimes they’re claims of convenience.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Look, surely to goodness – and I know you’re not going to comment on what the High Court might come up with in either of the cases for ASF17 or the other one that got belated recognition and was able to present a 20 minute argument, AZC20. But surely if the High Court rules in their favour and knocks the Immigration Minister out of the ballpark again, surely there’s got to be – you talk about a protection racket, when’s the protection racket going to stop for him and the Home Affairs Minister, Clare O’Neil? Surely the Prime Minister’s got to say, ‘listen, you two are lovely people, I’d love to come to dinner with you, but you can’t be Ministers in charge of these things, given how you’ve stuffed it up’?

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

No, and this is what happened with Julia Gillard when she was Prime Minister and Kevin Rudd, where they’ve got people in the ministry who are just completely unsuited. I mean, you have a look at Chris Bowen when he was in the immigration portfolio. I mean, you’ve covered it for a long time, Ray. But, hopeless – completely hopeless. Assistant Treasurer coming up with FuelWatch and Grocery Watch; all these, you know, Cash For Clunker programmes, Pink Batts, it was a disaster.

 

These people are in that category. I mean, Chris Bowen hasn’t moved from that category, but Clare O’Neil, how on earth she’s still got her job given the number of boats that have got through, people landing onto our shores undetected, they’ve cut back the amount of days that the ABF boats are at sea surveilling and protecting the coastline, they’ve cut back the aerial surveillance, and somehow she is still a Minister. And Minister Giles, who refuses to give evidence to the High Court in a previous matter that results in the Commonwealth losing that case, then gives rise to 150 criminals being released into the community. How they’ve got their jobs is beyond me.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Okay. We learned this week again, now, the Government decided that they’re going to halve – starting from July, in the next 12 months – the number of people coming here. Both legally and illegally, but legally we’ll start with. Then, it’s revealed by The Australian this week, that the record number of monthly permanent arrivals have come in. The difference between those going and those coming is 105,000 – which was up on the record from the previous month.

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

Well Ray, over the last two years, the Government’s brought in something like a million people, and the new house starts are just over 300,000. So, is it any wonder that we’ve got people who can’t find a home? You’ve got kids and grandkids who can’t find rental accommodation for love nor money, and the Government continues to bring people in in record numbers.

 

If you look at the last ten years, the numbers of house starts – house and unit starts, roughly matched about the number of people who are coming in. So, you haven’t created a housing crisis in that circumstance, but now they’ve got a situation of their own making, where – and at the same time you’ve got the CFMEU running completely out of control, sending builders broke and making it harder for people to find a builder if they’re a first home buyer or want to build a new home – and again, I mean, it’s a problem of the Albanese Government’s making. Everything the Prime Minister touches turns to dust. He’s taking a country in the wrong direction, and I think a lot of Australians are just shaking their head as to – it doesn’t get much more basic than that: if you bring a million people in, you’ve got to find houses for them. They don’t sleep on the street.

 

At the moment, Australians are sleeping on the street or can’t find a house and are staying at home longer or in rental accommodation where they otherwise want to go and buy a house but can’t get into the housing market. The Government’s created an absolute disaster of a mess here, and I don’t know how they’re going to clean it up.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Your reaction, as a former Minister, to Richard Marles’ defence spending announcement. How do you see it?

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

Well, I just think when you – again, it’s one of those issues where you want desperately to be in a bipartisan position of support with the Government, because it’s a very important topic. As Richard points out and as the Prime Minister’s pointed out, as we pointed out when we were in government, there is a huge likelihood, an increasingly, growing likelihood, that we’re going to see some sort of conflict over the next decade or so, and perhaps sooner than that in the South China Sea, and we don’t know what threats are on the horizon otherwise.

 

The world’s a very uncertain place at the moment, and yet the Government’s taking $80 billion out of Defence. There’s this whole sort of smoke and mirrors trick, and if anyone wants to read a bit more about it, I’d read Greg Sheridan’s piece in The Australian today because he sums it up perfectly. If you’re saying that there’s an urgent requirement to provide Defence with additional funding, it needs to be in the short term and meet that threat that the Defence Minister is speaking about. So, I think there are a lot of people in the Army at the moment who have had a lot of their programmes cut, who are furious with the approach of the Minister and the Prime Minister, and I think we might hear a bit more about that over the coming weeks.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

Okay. Well, given it’s Anzac Day next Thursday, I don’t know if we’ll get to chat. You’ll probably be pretty busy through the course of Anzac morning, but if not, we’ll catch up with you the following week.

 

PETER DUTTON:

 

Thanks, Ray. Take care, mate.

 

RAY HADLEY:

 

All the best. Peter Dutton, Federal Opposition Leader.

 

[ends]