Subjects: Jacinda Ardern; Office of the Special Investigator reports; Indigenous Voice to Parliament.
E&OE.
SARAH ABO:
As New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern steps down and a close election looms, we could soon see a fresh new government across the ditch. For more, we’re joined by Opposition Leader Peter Dutton in Murray Bridge in South Australia. Good morning. Good to see you. Now, how surprised were you by her resignation and what do you reckon this means for Australia’s relations with New Zealand?
PETER DUTTON:
Good morning, Sarah. Well, it was a surprise to everyone. Obviously, New Zealand’s an incredibly important partner for us and Jacinda Ardern has got a young family and politics is a pretty tiring business and at that level she’s obviously worked hard for her country and the causes that she believes in and she wants to step back and have a break. There’s obviously a huge political contest going on at the moment, people are making different comments in relation to motivations and what might happen at the election etc., but, in the end, the relationship between our two countries spans administrations and leaders and their families. So, we wish her well in retirement.
SARAH ABO:
It can take its toll, as you say. Five-and-a-half years, she says there’s not much left in the tank. What about you? You still got a bit in you?
PETER DUTTON:
Well, Sarah, I look 120 but I’m only 52. I don’t lead Karl’s life, of course – much more mundane…
SARAH ABO:
A bit older than Karl!
PETER DUTTON:
…was that too soon or not?! So, I’ve been in politics for 20 years, but I’m 52, I’ve got plenty of fuel left in the tank and I love this job. We’re up in Murray Bridge at the moment, just looking at some of the flood effects up here. The number one message is to make sure, please, book your holiday up here right across the Riverland or the Murrayland and get in contact with those local tourism operators. Book a holiday over the course of the next three, six, nine months and come and support a great industry.
SARAH ABO:
I do love SA. Murray Bridge is beautiful.
Okay, let’s go to that front page story in the SMH and The Age today by Nick McKenzie, the investigation into the war crimes in Afghanistan. It aims to lay criminal charges this year. Of course, this is still an investigation and there aren’t any suggestions yet of guilt. But does this highlight that changes are needed in our Defence Force? You must have a take on this as a former defence minister.
PETER DUTTON:
Well Sarah, we set up the process of the independent Special Investigator and it’s got expert investigators, it has a former judge in charge. So, we have a rule of law in our country and nobody’s above it. Everybody has to abide by it. But we also accept that people in war-like theatre are living in conditions that none of us can really imagine, and particularly in circumstances where their colleagues have been killed or slaughtered, it’s a difficult working environment and we put those troops into harm’s way and it’s a difficult circumstance. There are allegations that have been made – they should be investigated. They are being investigated according to the rule of law. But people have a presumption of innocence. If there is a case brought against somebody, it’s up to a judge and jury to decide innocence or guilt.
SARAH ABO:
You must be a bit concerned, though, that there’s a perception out there that our troops could go rogue or have gone rogue in the past?
PETER DUTTON:
Well, Sarah, I think that’s why the independent process is important, so that they can look at the facts, remove the emotion from it, find out what would be admissible if something was to be brought to court and whether or not they have a process to go before the courts and for a jury to decide somebody’s innocence or guilt. In addition to that, of course, there’s the process within the Australian Defence Force, and that’s a disciplinary issue for the Chief of the Defence Force. But I thought it very important that we set up an independent process so the allegations could be looked at and some of the allegations are made by SAS soldiers and others against some of their colleagues. So, it’s legitimate that there is a process to look at it and let’s see how that runs its course.
SARAH ABO:
The PM hasn’t ruled out going it alone on a Voice to Parliament, even if Aussies vote against the referendum. You’ve been very vocal about this, some might think your New Year’s resolution is to attack Albo. But if a model is proposed that you agree with, would you support pushing it straight through Parliament or are you going to keep attacking him?
PETER DUTTON:
Well, Sarah, it’s not a question of attack. I mean, what I’ve done is ask for the detail of the Voice and I just don’t know how that’s an attack. I think I’m speaking for millions of Australians when we say if we’re being asked to change the most important document in our country – the Constitution – it’s been the underpinning of the success and the stability of our democracy and our form of government for many decades since Federation and Australians don’t change that lightly, they understand that…
SARAH ABO:
It is something we’ve been speaking about for some time, though? The debate has been raging for a while.
PETER DUTTON:
But Sarah, we don’t know the basic detail. I mean, the Prime Minister on Ben Fordham’s programme the day before yesterday completely botched it. He’s changing transcripts to say something that he didn’t say. It’s quite bizarre and I just think Australians want the detail so that they can make an informed judgement. I’m in that category, and I just think it’s incumbent upon the Prime Minister to release that detail instead of looking tricky and hiding it. I think now people are starting to question his character, frankly, when he’s changing transcripts and being tricky and deceptive and answering questions in a way, frankly, that is just not honest.
SARAH ABO:
It sounds like you’re attacking him? You’re questioning him, that’s for sure.
PETER DUTTON:
Well, my job is to question him and to hold him to account. If you’re being asked to vote at a referendum to change the Constitution on a very important issue – all of us want to see a better outcome for Indigenous Australians. What we’re seeing in Alice Springs at the moment is a national disgrace and the Mayor up there has called the Attorney-General asking for additional Federal Police resources and the Albanese Government has refused that and I worry that we’re going to see tragedy in Alice Springs. It’s already been a very difficult situation there for families, for kids, for business owners, for just elderly people who want to go to the shops without being accosted and if that voice is not being heard from Alice Springs at the moment what…
SARAH ABO:
Ok, so just quickly, you wouldn’t support pushing it through Parliament then?
PETER DUTTON:
Well, we’ve got we’ve got a question of a referendum before us. Let’s hear the detail on that. I’ve been very clear that the government should pass legislation now – they can do that. They had the numbers in the Parliament to pass the Voice in legislation the week after next when we go back to Parliament and the Prime Minister refuses to answer the questions to whether he would do that.
SARAH ABO:
Alright, Peter Dutton, thanks for your time. Enjoy the sunshine down there in SA.
PETER DUTTON:
Thanks, Sarah.
[ends]