Subjects: The tragic death of Paul Green; China; Indo-Pacific relations; How to eat a Dagwood Dog, Ekka-style; the Acting Prime Minister’s Geelong washing machine dilemma.
ALLISON LANGDON
I know for me looking at the pics there too, Paul Green, that grand final win, the Cowboys, when it was JT who kicked the field goal in that golden point, it was one of the most extraordinary moments, but we know that Wally is really feeling that loss this morning. In fact, of course, Paul Green’s family and the whole rugby league world, our thoughts are with them this morning. Let’s go to Karl.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Just on that, too, Peter Dutton is joining us now, the Opposition Leader. He’s talking with Richard Marles, but you knew him, didn’t you? It was a big shock to everyone yesterday.
PETER DUTTON
Oh mate, just shocking news. You know, young kids, beautiful family, and he was a legend of the game and just respected by everyone. I think all these circumstances just shock people because, you know, everything in his life, as Wally just said, it was all to play for and whatever support can be provided to the family, I’m sure the rugby league community will.
KARL STEFANOVIC
You know, it was such a big thing for Townsville, too. North Queensland climbed a mountain with JT and that side. That was the most extraordinary grand final and one of the greatest sporting things I have ever seen. For him to help that side do that was really amazing.
Thank you for talking about that. Let’s move on now to these tensions that are growing in the region. China flagging this week they’re prepared to take Taiwan by force. Those comments putting Australia in a very precarious position.
Joining us now is, along with Opposition Leader Peter Dutton, is Richard Marles who is acting Prime Minister at the moment. Good morning to you both. Richard, to you, this is our backyard. Are you comfortable with the way the US is handling China right now or are you a little bit nervous?
RICHARD MARLES
Well, I think what we want to see is a de-escalation of tension across the board and I think we want to see a return to normality. Obviously the exercises that we are seeing from the Chinese in and around the Taiwan Straits is of concern, but what we want to see is a de-escalation of tensions, and to be honest, I think the world would breathe a sigh of relief if we were able to see a return to normal peaceful activity in that part of the world.
KARL STEFANOVIC
I appreciate that, but as we discussed a couple of days ago with Nancy Pelosi diving into Taiwan on a government jet, that wasn’t doing anything to wind things back, was it? It was winding things up. Is the US on the same page as us, do you think?
RICHARD MARLES
Well, we are very much on the same page with the United States. The question of Nancy Pelosi’s visit to Taiwan is ultimately a matter between the United States and Taiwan, so I’m not going to comment on that, but what we really need to see is a de- escalation of tension around Taiwan. That’s the critical issue here. I think the world wants to see that. I think we would all breathe a sigh of relief if we saw a return to normal, peaceful activity around there. From Australia’s point of view, and I’ve said this a lot over the last week, our engagement here is based on the fact that we have an unchanged policy of not wanting to see any change to the status quo across the Taiwan Strait.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Peter, in every conceivable way it is a disaster if Taiwan is taken by China. Your language has been very strong on it, you’re saying you’re not going to back down even though there are some inside your own party saying wind back the rhetoric because there are some key electorates that have a significant Chinese Australians who are voting. Are you going to do that, are you going to take a backwards step?
PETER DUTTON
No, I’m not Karl, and it’s not about politics. This is an issue of national security and importance for us and for the region. I think if you looked at what happened in Ukraine, I think there would be a lot of people saying: If only we put more pressure on Putin not to go into Ukraine in the first instance, we wouldn’t have the bloody scenes that we see now. There is no sense in a couple of months or a couple of years’ time saying: the Chinese have gone into Taiwan, we didn’t see this coming. I think we are right in shining a huge spotlight on the behaviour, calling it out. And I think if we do that, that gives us the best chance of keeping peace in our region.
KARL STEFANOVIC
But you know too this escalating rhetoric from the US, the US seems to be picking fights with a lot of people at the moment. We can debate whether that is right or wrong but in regards to China, it doesn’t help us, does it?
PETER DUTTON
Well Karl, I’ve a slightly different view. If you look at where the Chinese are on the Indian border at the moment, there are Indian troops that have lost their lives at the hands of Chinese troops on that disputed border just in the last few years. The Chinese are in the East China Sea and the Senkaku Islands bumping up against the Japanese Coast Guard. They’re obviously very provocative in our region, and clearly in relation to Taiwan. So, it’s China that’s changed here – not the US, or Australia, or India, or New Zealand.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Just out of interest, Richard, how would we defend ourselves if China parked six Jin class submarines off Port Douglas?
RICHARD MARLES
Well, look, I don’t think it helps to speculate about that. What we do have is a very capable Defence Force, but one that we want to make more capable. So, the focus of the strategic review that we’ve announced is trying to make sure we build the potency of the Australian Defence Force as we go forward in the years ahead. But can I just say, I wouldn’t agree with your characterisation of the United States either. I mean, I think the United States’ action here is, I think, consistent with ours, which is about defending a global rules-based order, a global rules-based order that all of us helped build from the immediacy of the Second World War and since, and things like the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea, which provides freedom of navigation for a trading island like Australia – that is fundamentally important to our national interest. Most of our trade, for example, goes through the South China Sea. So, the rules of the road applying all over the world including within the Indo-Pacific are fundamentally important to Australia.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Ok. If they take Taiwan and we have massive problems with chips, we’ve got a whole bunch of things that will possibly affect trade, affect production of any kind of good and the manufacturing sector. I mean, across the board it is going to be a disaster. I have a solution, Richard, this morning. Pete, I will get your opinion on it too. What we should do is we should send Chris Uhlmann up there with a slouch hat and a megaphone to deal with the Chinese. Don’t you reckon that would be perfect? Richard, you first.
RICHARD MARLES
That is a terrifying prospect and, indeed, Chris may well be the most potent asset that we have in the nation. We need to be sending him on the front line. I ran into Chris on Wednesday, just as he was about to head off to the National Press Club to ask questions of the Chinese Ambassador, so we need to get Chris out there.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Send him in.
PETER DUTTON
And maybe dress him up in those red DTs you had on in that promo shot before for your birthday, Karl. Just to grab attention completely.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Just to frighten them.
PETER DUTTON
I’ve got to say, I mean, Chris is one of the bravest voices and he’s been calling this behaviour out – and one of the great journos in our country.
KARL STEFANOVIC
You are relatively new to Opposition Leader status. There’s something I wanted to bring up with you. Look, there’s been some significant photos of various opposition leaders over the years taken. This is an important thing to bring up with you and Richard will have an opinion on this, I’m sure, as well.
PETER DUTTON
This is breakfast TV Karl, just remind people…
KARL STEFANOVIC
This is breakfast TV, it is the rich tapestry. This is Bill Shorten, by the way, eating a sausage. Then there’s Tony Abbott eating an onion, just delicious stuff. We have Peter Dutton now eating a Dagwood Dog. Look at that. I mean, that…
PETER DUTTON
What could go wrong with that photo?!
KARL STEFANOVIC
What is going on there? I mean is this a couple of…
PETER DUTTON
Well, what do you do there?! Do you eat it on the side and then you chew into the stick?
KARL STEFANOVIC
I think so. I think so.
PETER DUTTON
You drop the sauce on your pants, which is a bad shot. I mean, what choice were you giving me?!
KARL STEFANOVIC
I think it’s a great shot.
PETER DUTTON
And if you go to the Ekka you’ve got to have a Dagwood Dog.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Yeah, you do. Richard? Yeah go on, Richard.
RICHARD MARLES
Can I just say, as always, Peter is an absolute picture of elegance.
KARL STEFANOVIC
I’m just going to bring up something up with you too, Richard, because there has been challenges as acting Prime Minister.
RICHARD MARLES
Oh, gosh.
KARL STEFANOVIC
Perhaps you didn’t see this one coming. Reports this morning, the man in charge of running the country – which is you this week – encountered a major domestic crisis. His washing machine broke, so no big issue, you can just head to the local laundromat. But what happened next, Richard? Share it with the nation.
RICHARD MARLES
Well, yes, we did get to the laundromat with six Federal Police. You know, as they’re talking into their cuffs and all the other people in the laundromat were thinking, what on earth is going on here? They weren’t actually wearing dark sunglasses but it felt a bit like that. We managed to get in there and get the job done, myself and my son.
PETER DUTTON
Richard wouldn’t know whether he’s got a front loader or top loader at home!
RICHARD MARLES
That’s not true! I do the washing. I do the washing!
PETER DUTTON
I want to see evidence!
KARL STEFANOVIC
Gentlemen, great to talk to you. Lots going on in the world. Appreciate it, as always every Friday. Thanks guys.
ALLISON LANGDON
I just want to know if Richard understands that doing the washing doesn’t mean putting it in the machine and leaving it there, it means the rest of it as well!
KARL STEFANOVIC
Yeah, get him Ally.
[ends]